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As far as I can see, a card counter is still subject to the same mechanic as any other players, but they are able to perform better then most people within these confines.
So why is card counting a justification for casinos to kick people out?
Obviously, a card counter will cost them money, but if that is the only justification, then it's like the casino is cheating- they only allow sucky players to play.
If you are too good you get thrown out.
Is that all there is to it, or is there a valid gameplay justification for this?
Actually, it is not the "mechanic," that makes for card counting.
What card counters mostly do is to vary their bet sizes in their own favor.
See my answer below.
I was under the impression that if all players play by what the casino deems are the accepted rules, then statistically, the players collectively are essentially bound to lose to the house.
You have a few advantages, but also have to play by strict and predictable conventions, but the thousand can play in any manner they choose.
You also know that one of those thousand is capable of card-counting.
You wouldn't risk your money betting against someone with such an advantage would you?
You'd stick with the odds, and play only the other 999.
A perfectly sensible and logical position, which techniques au blackjack, in essence, the same position the casino takes.
OK this actually makes sense.
As a slightly off topic followup, do casinos typically let you keep what you won if they do catch you card counting?
They may have the right to choose not to play with you, but the games in which they did play with you should be considered legitimate, right?
Only if you've used a counting device, or properly cheated etc, but then they also throw you in jail after taking back the money : Of course, there's nothing to say you aren't going to suffer a few accidents "falling down the stairs" on your way out of the casino.
Casinos have the right to deny service to anyone, and of makes sense to deny players from playing a game in which they have an advantage versus the house.
This isn't cheating in any sense of the word.
On one hand, here establishments have the unquestioned right to protect themselves against so-called "card counters" who have developed expertise in the game of "blackjack" "twenty-one".
On the other hand, neither card counting nor the use of a legal subterfuge such as a disguise to gain access to this table game is illegal under Nevada law.
Casinos pretend that they let you gamble in a game that has certain rules, but if you use skill to win, then you are not allowed to play, even if you play within the confines of those rules.
Sounds like fraud to me.
Yes, even if the game was precisely even; the mathematics is interesting.
Unless you use a "device" such as a computer to do so in Nevada, which is a felony under Nevada law.
Card counting is frowned upon because it violates the UNWRITTEN "law" that the casino is supposed to have the edge.
From the CASINO's point of view, it is a case of "if this isn't illegal, it ought to be.
But Nevada courts do tend to side with the casinos for read more reasons.
If a player played "Basic" optimal strategy, and "flat bet," bet the same on every handthe something blackjack crossing golf scorecard can would have an edge of about 1%.
What card counters do is to watch for a handful of situations that come up occasionally, where the player is favored.
Then they "jump" their bets by five or ten times to take advantage of these situations, and bet a "basic" unit at other times, shifting the odds in their favor.
This is a form of "trolling.
This strategy calls for the big player to "table hop" in a seemingly random fashion but actually based on signals from his teammates.
Needless to say, "trolling" and "table hopping," whether or not for the purpose of making money, while not illegal, are socially gauche.
So casinos will eject players for that kind of behavior alone, whether or not connected with card counting.
And the assumption is that most people would not engage in that kind of behavior unless they are card counting.
Card counter Kenny Uston won a court case in New Jersey that prohibits Atlantic City casinos from barring or harassing card counters.
They are allowed to take "defensive" measures such as shuffling up after every deal.
I heard that the house edge on a person playing by basic strategy was much lower than that; an eight-deck game with no additional rules benefiting the player like hitting split aces or dealer must hit soft 17 has a house techniques au blackjack of about.
This is further reduced with fewer decks in the shoe.
But card counters overcome this advantage by betting big on certain "good" hands and betting small on most other "bad" ones.
That's the point of counting cards.
Meaning that if card counters were forced to "flat bet," techniques au blackjack would lose.
My point was that you said there was a 1% house edge against a player using only basic strategy, which is a little high.
Then the casinos reduced the payouts on blackjack from 3 to 2 to 4 to 3, in some cases even 5 to 4, which took their edge above 1%.
It is some fraction of 1 percent depending on house rules against a "skilled" player who plays optimally but doesn't vary his bets based on card-counting.
That's just a theoretical construct.
It is negative against a skilled card counter who varies his bets.
So "bet management" is a key skill in the game.
The rules of blackjack say nothing about dealing multiple hands from the same pre-shuffled stack - but that's exactly what makes card counting possible.
Some casinos use them, but most seem to prefer making a fuss about card counters.
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As far as I can see, a card counter is still subject to the same mechanic as any other players, but they are able to perform better then most people within these confines.
So why is card counting a justification for casinos to kick people out?
Obviously, a card counter will cost them money, but if that is the only justification, then it's like the casino is cheating- they only allow sucky players to play.
If you are too good you get thrown out.
Is that all there is to it, or is there a valid gameplay justification for this?
Actually, it is not the "mechanic," that makes for card counting.
What card counters mostly do is to vary their bet sizes in their own favor.
See my answer below.
I was under the impression that if all players play by what the casino deems are the accepted rules, then statistically, the players collectively are essentially bound to lose to the house.
You have a few advantages, but also have to play by strict and predictable conventions, but the thousand can play in any manner they choose.
You also know that one of those thousand learn more here capable of card-counting.
You wouldn't risk your money betting against someone with such an advantage would you?
You'd stick with the odds, and play only the other 999.
A perfectly sensible and logical position, which is, in essence, the same position the casino takes.
OK this actually makes sense.
As a slightly off topic followup, do casinos typically let you keep what you won if they do catch you card counting?
They may have the right to choose not to play with you, techniques au blackjack the games in which they did play with you should be considered legitimate, right?
Only if you've used a counting device, or properly cheated etc, but then they also throw you in jail after taking back the money : Of course, there's nothing to say you aren't going to suffer a few accidents "falling down the stairs" on your way out of the casino.
Casinos have the right to deny service to anyone, and of makes sense to deny players from playing a game in which they have visit web page advantage versus the house.
This isn't cheating in any sense of the word.
scales blackjack 155 handle one hand, gaming establishments have the unquestioned right to protect themselves against so-called "card counters" who have developed expertise in the game of "blackjack" "twenty-one".
On the other hand, neither card counting nor the use of a legal subterfuge such as a disguise to gain access to this table game is illegal under Nevada law.
Sounds like fraud to me.
Yes, even if the game was precisely even; the mathematics is interesting.
Unless you use a "device" such as a computer to do so in Nevada, which is a felony under Nevada law.
Card counting is frowned upon because it violates the UNWRITTEN "law" that the casino is supposed to have the edge.
From the CASINO's point of view, it is a case of "if this isn't illegal, it ought to be.
But Nevada courts do tend to side with the casinos for economic reasons.
If a player played "Basic" optimal strategy, and "flat bet," bet the same on every handthe casino would have an edge of about 1%.
What card counters do is to watch for a handful of situations that come up occasionally, where the player is favored.
Then they "jump" their bets by five or ten times to take advantage of these situations, and bet a "basic" unit at other times, shifting the odds in their favor.
This is a form of "trolling.
This strategy calls for the big player to "table hop" in a seemingly random fashion but actually based on signals from his teammates.
Needless to say, "trolling" and "table hopping," whether or not for the purpose of making money, while not illegal, are socially gauche.
So casinos will eject players for that kind of behavior alone, whether or not connected with card counting.
review blackjack watch behavior unless they are card counting.
Card counter Kenny Uston won a court case in New Jersey that prohibits Atlantic City casinos from barring or harassing card counters.
They are allowed to take "defensive" measures such as shuffling up after every deal.
This is further reduced with fewer decks in the shoe.
As entertainment goes, not bad.
But card counters overcome this advantage by betting big on certain "good" hands and betting small on most other "bad" ones.
That's the point of counting cards.
Meaning that if card counters were forced to "flat bet," they would lose.
My point was that techniques au blackjack said there was a 1% house edge against a player using only basic strategy, which is a little high.
Then the casinos reduced the payouts on blackjack from 3 to 2 to 4 to 3, in some cases even 5 to 4, which took their edge above 1%.
That's just a theoretical construct.
It is negative against a skilled card counter who varies his bets.
So "bet management" is a key skill in the game.
The rules of blackjack say nothing about dealing multiple hands from the same pre-shuffled stack - but that's exactly what makes card counting possible.
Some casinos use them, but most seem to prefer making a fuss about card counters.
Earn 10 reputation in order to answer this question.
The reputation requirement helps protect this question from spam and non-answer activity.
Not the answer you're looking for?
Browse other questions tagged or.